Tesla news

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alpax
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Re: Tesla news

Сообщение alpax »

Waterbyte писал(а):принципиальной разницы между седанами нету
Вот так и получается сравнение яблок с апельсинами. Ведь и то и другое - фрукты, и то и другое - круглое и сладкое.
У меня только один вопрос: почему бензиновые яблоки сравниваются исключительно с электрическими апельсинами, и на основе этого делается вывод, что электрические - плохие, потому что дороже.
Waterbyte писал(а):поэтому мне неочевидно, почему нельзя сравнивать теслу с той же короллой или ещё какой жоповозкой.
А почему ты не сравниваешь эту короллу, цена которой начинается от 16 тыс., с Lexus LS ценой от 100 тыс., ну или хотя бы IS - этот вообще ведь практически та же королла, но почему-то стоит $41-56k? Ведь принципиальной разницы между седанами нет.
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Waterbyte
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Сообщение Waterbyte »

alpax писал(а):
Waterbyte писал(а):принципиальной разницы между седанами нету
Вот так и получается сравнение яблок с апельсинами. Ведь и то и другое - фрукты, и то и другое - круглое и сладкое.
У меня только один вопрос: почему бензиновые яблоки сравниваются исключительно с электрическими апельсинами, и на основе этого делается вывод, что электрические - плохие, потому что дороже.
где такой вывод делается? на мой взгляд, только у тебя в голове.
alpax писал(а):
Waterbyte писал(а):поэтому мне неочевидно, почему нельзя сравнивать теслу с той же короллой или ещё какой жоповозкой.
А почему ты не сравниваешь эту короллу, цена которой начинается от 16 тыс., с Lexus LS ценой от 100 тыс., ну или хотя бы IS - этот вообще ведь практически та же королла, но почему-то стоит $41-56k? Ведь принципиальной разницы между седанами нет.
почему не сравниваю? очень даже сравниваю. и делаю выбор в пользу короллы. короллу я не сравниваю с каким-нть вэном, в который набить можно семь человек, или там сувом полноприводным, который по говнам умеет ездить, да ещё и лодку при этом за собой таскать.
LeeVan
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Сообщение LeeVan »

alpax писал(а):А почему ты не сравниваешь эту короллу, цена которой начинается от 16 тыс., с Lexus LS ценой от 100 тыс., ну или хотя бы IS - этот вообще ведь практически та же королла, но почему-то стоит $41-56k? Ведь принципиальной разницы между седанами нет.
Можно пример? - спросила Гера.
- Можно, - ответил Энлиль Маратович. - Представь себе, скажем... Что ты стоишь на Новом Арбате и смотришь на два припаркованных у казино автомобиля. По виду они почти одинаковые - черные и длинные. Ну, может быть, один чуть ниже и длиннее. Представила?
- Да, - сказала Гера.
- Когда ты замечаешь разницу в форме кузова и фар, отличие в звуке мотора и рисунке шин - это работает ум "А". А когда ты видишь два "мерса", один из которых гламурный, потому что это дорогущая модель прошлого года, а другой - срачный ацтой, потому что на таком еще Березовский ездил в баню к
генералу Лебедю, и в наши дни его можно взять за пятнадцать грин – это работает ум "Б". Это и есть полярное сияние, которое он производит. Но для тебя оно накладывается на две черных машины, стоящих рядом. И тебе кажется, что продукт ума "Б" - это отражение чего-то, действительно существующего снаружи.
Биркин
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Сообщение Биркин »

Утащено из соседней ветки - ох.ительная практика если честно. неужели нормальный поставщик на такое согласится и не пошлет это все далеко?
In an unusual move, Tesla reportedly asked some suppliers to return part of the money it’s paid them since 2016, including for past work. According to the Wall Street Journal, which reviewed a memo Tesla sent to a supplier last week, the electric auto maker said it is asking suppliers for refunds to help it reach profitability.
Tesla declined to comment about the memo to the Wall Street Journal, but said it is seeking price reductions on some projects, including several dating back to 2016 and some which haven’t been completed. It also told the newspaper that requests like the memo are standard in procurement negotiations between auto manufacturers and their suppliers.
LeeVan
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Сообщение LeeVan »

Могут и согласиться.
Зависит от высоты налития стакана и видов на прогнозируемый урожай.
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alpax
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Re: Tesla news

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Биркин писал(а):Утащено из соседней ветки - ох.ительная практика если честно. неужели нормальный поставщик на такое согласится и не пошлет это все далеко?
In an unusual move, Tesla reportedly asked some suppliers to return part of the money it’s paid them since 2016, including for past work. According to the Wall Street Journal, which reviewed a memo Tesla sent to a supplier last week, the electric auto maker said it is asking suppliers for refunds to help it reach profitability.
Tesla declined to comment about the memo to the Wall Street Journal, but said it is seeking price reductions on some projects, including several dating back to 2016 and some which haven’t been completed. It also told the newspaper that requests like the memo are standard in procurement negotiations between auto manufacturers and their suppliers.
Просто бизнес - ничего личного. Это ж рынок: получают оффер, делают встречное предложение... Думаю, у поставщиков вполне есть возможность торговаться. Тесле тоже мало радости "менять коней на переправе". Ну а не согласятся, потеряют клиента с рынком в полмиллиона (а потенциально - в разы больше) комплектов частей.

На самом деле всё не так плохо, как в очередной раз пытаются показать журналюги.

Разъяснение от Маска:
Elon Musk
@elonmusk

Only costs that actually apply to Q3 & beyond will be counted. It would not be correct to apply historical cost savings to current quarter.
Официальный комментарий от компании:
“Negotiation is a standard part of the procurement process, and now that we’re in a stronger position with Model 3 production ramping, it is a good time to improve our competitive advantage in this area. We’re focused on reaching a more sustainable long term cost basis, not just finding one-time reductions for this quarter, and that’s good for Tesla, our shareholders, and our suppliers who will also benefit from our increasing production volume and future growth opportunities. We asked fewer than 10 suppliers for a reduction in total capex project spend for long-term projects that began in 2016 but are still not complete, and any changes with these suppliers would improve our future cash flows, but not impact our ability to achieve profitability in Q3. The remainder of our discussions with suppliers are entirely focused on future parts price and design or process changes that will help us lower fundamental costs rather than prior period adjustments of capex projects. This is the right thing to do.”
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ingvar
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Сообщение ingvar »

It may look like ordinary thing. However, cash refunds is coincided with Tesla's inability to deliver Model 3 to the market.
Either price will go up, and it already did (Tesla offered upscale versions of Model 3), or customers may get their deposits back and never get a chance to drive the vehicle.
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alpax
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ingvar писал(а):It may look like ordinary thing. However, cash refunds is coincided with Tesla's inability to deliver Model 3 to the market.
Ты под каким камнем жил последние месяцы? Model 3 уже выходит на плановые объёмы производства. Уже производят по 15-20 тыс. в месяц, скоро будет 25, ну и дальше будут наращивать до 40.
ingvar писал(а):Either price will go up, and it already did (Tesla offered upscale versions of Model 3),
Это не цена увеличилась, а появились новые версии - именно потому, что достигнуты объёмы, при которых уже появляется возможность "распыляться" на несколько модификаций. Да, версии более дорогие (собственно с самого начала была только дорогая модификация), но и расчитаны они на соответствующих покупателей. Базовая более дешёвая версия однозначно будет - большинство стоящих в очереди ждут именно её, так что Тесле придётся выпускать такую в любом случае, но это будет только после выхода на более высокие объёмы производства - 30-40 тыс. в месяц, чтобы даже эта версия была прибыльной.
ingvar писал(а):or customers may get their deposits back and never get a chance to drive the vehicle.
Кстати, многие депозиты уже сейчас забирают, но не потому, что не хотят больше эту машину, а потому что Тесла открыла доступ к заказам для всех желающих, и держаться за место в очереди уже как бы и не очень надо.
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ingvar
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Сообщение ingvar »

Numbers as projected to dissolve the cost. Why would he ask for cash if according to some optimistic sources he has it (production target is met).
Isn't it a more viable option to focus on the base model and outsell the competitors. Tesla gets cash and people get their products.
Slav
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Сообщение Slav »

ingvar писал(а):...to focus on the base model and outsell the competitors...
И где ты видишь конкурентов базовой модели?
Шеви Болт, очередь на который 4 месяца и больше?
Который вообще перестали продавать в Европу?
Э..., а больше нет от слова СОВСЕМ.

Назови мне электричку с пробегом в 400 км (Тесла, базовая модель) и ценой от 40 штук (Тесла, базовая модель), которую можно пойти и КУПИТЬ СЕГОДНЯ.

Их просто нет, конкурентов (базовой модели Тесла 3).
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ingvar
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Сообщение ingvar »

Calm down, if you ever want people to read what you wrote.
Competitors of Tesla are those that Elon wanted to kill and that is all the vehicles with internal combustion engines of the same category that Model 3 represents.
If you still insists on an EV to EV comparison, and you have mentioned a Bolt. There are still a lot more Chevy Bolts on the road than Model 3s (that's in US).


PS: GM got you guys on a leash for a few years. And who knows what "offers" they come up with to keep you there, at the end of the term.
Slav
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Сообщение Slav »

Браво.
Такая легкая и изящная подмена своего первого утверждения:
ingvar писал(а):...to focus on the base model and outsell the competitors...
неким другим:
ingvar писал(а):... There are still a lot more Chevy Bolts on the road than Model 3s (that's in US)...
Slav
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Re: Tesla news

Сообщение Slav »

ingvar писал(а):...Calm down, if you ever want people to read what you wrote...
После того как я узнал, что меня стали пародировать, вопрос, читают ли меня, уже не стоИт.
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alpax
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Re: Tesla news

Сообщение alpax »

ingvar писал(а):If you still insists on an EV to EV comparison, and you have mentioned a Bolt. There are still a lot more Chevy Bolts on the road than Model 3s (that's in US).
Ну да, у GM был год на то, чтобы получить существенное преимущество перед Теслой, и перетянуть на свою сторону желающих купить Model 3. Но в результате за всё это время они выпустили и продали всего около 32 тыс. Bolt. Тесла начала выпускать Model 3 в небольших количествах лишь в конце прошлого года, и по данным за июнь в сумме уже продала около 26 тыс. К началу августа они с Chevy сравняются, а дальше Bolt так и будет выпускаться в час по чайной ложке, в то время как Model 3 будет приближаться к 10 тыс. в неделю.
ingvar писал(а):Competitors of Tesla are those that Elon wanted to kill and that is all the vehicles with internal combustion engines of the same category that Model 3 represents.
Эти competitors - уже в заднице. В Штатах Model 3 уже сейчас продаётся больше, чем одноклассников от BMW, MB, Audi, и Lexus - вместе взятых.
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alpax
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Tesla Second Quarter 2018 Update
  • Q2 Automotive gross margin increased to 20.6% GAAP and 21.0% non-GAAP
  • Model 3 gross margin turned slightly positive in Q2, expecting roughly 15% in Q3
  • Expecting to produce 50-55k Model 3s in Q3; deliveries should exceed that
  • Major cost restructuring executed in Q2
  • $2.2B of cash and cash equivalents at Q2-end, expected to grow in Q3 and Q4
  • Capex projection in 2018 adjusted to <$2.5B
It’s fair to say that no production ramp of any other product has been as closely watched and debated as that of Model 3. We are proud of our team for producing roughly 7,000 Model 3, Model S and Model X vehicles during the last week of June. We also want to thank all of our reservation holders who have waited patiently and who have been supportive of our mission. While we faced multiple obstacles during this ramp, our team worked hard to find solutions, and in the end, it was all worth it: A total vehicle output of 7,000 vehicles per week, or 350,000 per year, should enable Tesla to become sustainably profitable for the first time in our history - and we expect to grow our production rate further in Q3.

In July 2018, Model 3 not only had the #1 market share position in its segment in the US, it outsold all other mid-sized premium sedans combined, accounting for 52% of the segment overall. The popularity of Model 3 is a true testament to the product. Based on trade-ins that we’ve received so far, we can see that the total addressable market for Model 3 is much larger than mid-sized premium sedans. We are drawing customers from many other segments, including non-premiums sedans and hatchbacks.

AUTOMOTIVE PRODUCTS

During the month of July, we have repeated weekly production of approximately 5,000 Model 3 cars multiple times while also producing 2,000 Model S and X per week. Having achieved our 5,000 per week milestone, we will now continue to increase that further, with our aim being to produce 6,000 Model 3 vehicles per week by late August. We then expect to increase production over the next few quarters beyond 6,000 per week, while keeping additional capex limited. We believe that increasing capacity by improving utilization of our existing lines and making selective improvements to address bottlenecks rather than creating entirely new duplicated lines will be the most capital efficient approach.

We aim to increase production to 10,000 Model 3s per week as fast as we can. We believe that the majority of Tesla’s production lines will be ready to produce at this rate by end of this year, but we will still have to increase capacity in certain places and we will need our suppliers to meet this as well. As a result, we expect to hit this rate sometime next year.

Over the past 12 months, we have overcome bottlenecks across various stages of the Model 3 manufacturing process. Last quarter, it became clear that GA3, our main general assembly line, would likely become a production constraint if certain issues were not addressed. This assembly line, which is where we add all the components to a painted metal body, was designed to work with hundreds of robotic lifters that bring components to the line. Due to the density of the line and the relatively high downtime of the lifters, ramping GA3 became substantially more complicated than we had anticipated. That said, significant progress has been made in the last few months, and GA3 is now expected to reach a production rate of 5,000 per week very soon.

To address the short-term issues with GA3, we built GA4 to help us reach our 5,000 units per week target earlier and ultimately to push us past that point. We were able to build GA4 quickly due to the designed simplicity of the Model 3 architecture. The layout and processes of GA4 are similar to those of the Model S and X assembly line, while quality and cost of production are roughly equal to those of GA3. General assembly, excluding the cost of components, accounts for approximately 3% of Model 3 cost. The rest of our manufacturing processes remain highly automated, including stamping, body-welding, paint shop, powertrain assembly and battery pack assembly.

No production target is more important than sustained quality, which is why every vehicle we produce goes through a thorough set of measurements and tests before it reaches the customer. Model 3 quality continues to improve every month and is already on par with Model S and X.

At the end of Q2, we started to produce the performance version of Model 3 Dual Motor All-Wheel Drive. The Wall Street Journal called it a “thrilling, modern marvel” and a vehicle that is “magnificent, a spaceship, so obviously representative of the next step in the history of automobiles. The Model 3 is more than futuristic. It’s optimistic. This is what ordinary cars should be, which is to say, better than they are.” Motor Trend said: “In maybe 120 wheel revolutions, a high-performance hierarchy has been rattled. The European marques perennially atop the sport sedan podium are about to have trapdoors release beneath them….[T]he dual motor and all-wheel drive give the compact Tesla a tensed, hair-trigger potency for leaping ahead or around whatever's in the way. It's pure jungle cat.” The performance version accelerates from 0 to 60 mph in just 3.5 seconds, which puts it into supercar territory, and with a starting price of $64,000, it is no more expensive than other high-spec premium sedans on the market today. Traction control software of Model 3 Performance has been substantially modified and it now allows drivers to powerslide, something that true track enthusiasts have been craving.

At the end of July, Gigafactory 1 battery production reached an annualized run rate of roughly 20 GWh, making it the highest-volume battery plant in the world by a significant margin. Consequently, Tesla currently produces more batteries in terms of kWh than all other carmakers combined.

In July, we announced our plan to build a wholly Tesla-owned Gigafactory 3 in Shanghai – our first Gigafactory outside the US. We are excited about this opportunity, as China is by far the largest EV market in the world and Chinese support for electric vehicles has been exceptionally strong. Initial capacity is expected to be roughly 250,000 vehicles and battery packs per year, and will grow to 500,000, with the first cars expected to roll off the production line in about three years. Vehicles produced at Gigafactory 3 will augment our existing capacity in order to meet growing local needs, which means our US manufacturing operations will not be affected. Construction is expected to start within the next few quarters, though our initial investment will not start in any significant way until 2019, with much of it expected to be funded through local debt. We will share more information about Gigafactory 3 in upcoming quarters. Demand for Model S and Model X vehicles remains high, with Q2 2018 being our highest ever Q2 for Model S and Model X orders. In July 2018, we delivered our 200,000th vehicle in the US, which means that our US customers will have access to the full $7,500 federal tax credit until the end of 2018, at which point it will phase out over the course of 2019. We produced 53,339 vehicles in Q2 and delivered 22,319 Model S and Model X vehicles and 18,449 Model 3 vehicles, totaling 40,768 deliveries.

Given that we are in full production mode for Model 3, we recently stopped taking Model 3 reservations in the US and Canada and moved to a direct order system, similar to our process for Model S and Model X. We continue to generate strong Model 3 demand despite having done almost nothing to try to sell it, and even though Model 3s have only been available to cash/loan purchasers of the long-range battery version with the premium interior package in North America. Demand will accelerate even further once we offer leases, less expensive variants, and orders outside of North America. Additionally, we recently started taking requests for Model 3 test drives in July and have already received more than 60,000 Model 3 test drive requests in the US alone. Most stores in North America were just getting Model 3s for test drives in July 2018. Early results indicate that the Model 3 test drive-to-order conversion rate is higher than for Model S, so weekly orders should grow significantly in upcoming months. In recent weeks, orders from non-reservation holders have already become a significant portion of our total new Model 3 orders, suggesting that we have barely tapped the full potential of Model 3 demand. While tariffs on vehicle imports to China have recently decreased to 15%, imports specifically from the US have increased to 40%. As a result, we had to adjust pricing in China in order to partially offset this increased cost. This will likely have some negative impact on our volumes in China in the near term. However, we do not expect our global vehicle deliveries to be heavily impacted since we will partially divert deliveries to North America and Europe if necessary.

Consistent with our mindset of continuous improvement for our products, we continued to add functionality to our vehicles in Q2. Thanks to the feedback we received, we significantly reduced braking distance of Model 3 through an over-the-air update. Summon and Wi-Fi functionality have also been added to Model 3 vehicles as well as an optional max speed limiter for all Tesla owners. We continue to analyze feedback from our customers on a regular basis and update functionality of our cars accordingly.

During Q2, we opened eight new store and service locations, resulting in 347 locations worldwide at the end of the quarter. Our electrified Mobile Service fleet continued to grow further to more than 340 service vehicles on the road today. While the majority of our mobile service network is based in the US, we are gradually rolling it out to other parts of the world. Our customers have shown a clear preference for getting their vehicles repaired at home or at work, which is why Mobile Service will continue to be a big lever for our service capacity expansion.

In Q2, we opened 103 new Supercharger locations for a total of 1,308 Supercharger stations and in late June celebrated our 10,000th Supercharger stall opening. To date, we have over 10,800 Superchargers and 19,200 Destination Charging connectors globally. We also continue to work with large employers to install chargers at their office locations so that customers lacking easy charging solutions at home can still switch to an electric vehicle.
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